This is a WIP Ultimate Super Deathguard Tactica (of death)
My plan is to expand this as and when, in particular once 5th is officially out and we’ve played a few games. However we’re all familiar with the new codex so we can make a start. I encorage everyone to throw in their ideas. I will edit the first post accordingly and in time Papanurgle shall have the definitive Deathguard Tactica.Let’s start with a simple question: what is it that’s in a Deathguard army?
Well, Plaguemarines obviously, models with the Mark of Nurgle, units with an Icon of Nurgle, vehicles, summoned daemons and spawn. Obliterators don’t fit into any of these, I’ll get to them later.
The almighty Plaguemarines:Plaguemarines are where it’s at. In my opinion no Deathguard army should be without at least three decent sized units of Plaguemarines, furthermore I don’t think you should have more non-PM units that PM units (characters not included).
Now, we all know what’s cool about our beloved PMs, but I’ll recap anyway –
Toughness 5 & Feel no Pain! Fearlessness, and pure, awesome Nurglishness.
The bad is their high points cost, lack of heavy weaponry and close combat punch.
I’m not going to go into too much detail here as we should already know what to do with our Plaguemarines, and of course once we’ve got a few 5th ed games under our belt subtle (or even major) changes in opinion are likely. The fact that troops are more vital than ever can only reinforce my ideal that Plaguemarines should account for the vast majority of the army.
Basically PMs are short ranged fire fighters, and damn resilient to boot. Always take two plasma guns in each of your Plaguemarine units.
Always.
Flamers and Meltaguns are great weapons, don't get me wrong, but for a Plaguemarine squad the mighty plasma wins.
Meltas are tank-busting weapons first and foremost, and yes they can take out heavy infantry but so can the plasma gun, with twice the number of shots at 12". You need to be up close and personal to get the maximum out of your meltagun which will mean moving a PM squad next to a tank and generally either in danger of being assaulted, or far from the majority of the enemy (tanks like flanks). Meltas do have a home in the Deathguard army - namely the fast attack section (and perhaps Terminators) which I shall cover soon
Flamers are clearly challenged in the range category, again often forcing you to get a little
too close to the enemy. They can be difficult weapons to get the most out of and are very much a situational weapon. In large numbers they can be fearsome indeed, but unless you know you're playing against a hoard (or are loading up on multiple (i.e. 3+) flamers) the flamer is too specific a weapon, and as such an inferior choice to the plasmagun.
You should avoid close combat at all costs for it is there that we lose our advantage and our Initiative of 3 can be exploited. Don’t be fooled by our resilience – it can and will count for nothing when faced with dedicated assault units which is what’s most likely to be charging in.
An aspiring champion with the ‘Obligatory Powerfist’ does not grant you any significantly greater close combat ability, and nor should you include one in each and every unit, save the points for more PMs.
Also beware of small to medium units of Plaguemarines being in the position to be assaulted en masse; your fearlessness will be your undoing.
Units with an Icon of Nurgle:Generally speaking, Plaguemarines are anti-infantry firepower position-holding dudes of win, and with the plasma load out they can tackle heavy infantry and light vehicles too.
Your other units should be chosen to specifically handle a task not usually suited to the Plaguemarines, also, as a rule of thumb they should be optimized for one role only.
As we all know the Icon of Nurgle is expensive. It is debatable whether or not tougher troops are better than more troops, but we mustn’t forget that the icon is a teleport homer as well; useful in conjunction with models in Terminator armour or with jump packs/wings as well as the often overlooked generic lesser daemons. I’ll talk about the importance of synergy at some point in the future.
In the next few days I’ll expand and talk about each unit, for the time being here’s a list of pros and cons…
Terminators:Having received a significant points reduction Terminators are almost a must-have in any Chaos army. For the most part they fulfill a role similar to your Plaguemarines, in that they excel in firefights and are tough to take down. In addition to this they can be used as an excellent assault unit thanks to being universally equipped with power weapons, and of course being able to teleport into battle helps!
A terminator as it comes is very cost effective – the basic equipment of a combi bolter & power weapon is more than adequate for the majority of situations. It’s the variety of options available that often leads to expensive and confused terminator units.
Let’s look at upgrading the combi-weapon first – for the points you pay you get a single use of a flamer, meltagun or plasmagun. Now you’re probably thinking I’m going to insist on plasma upgrades – well, I’m not. Why? Well you should have plenty of plasmaguns already
Given that a terminator is already equipped with armour save ignoring power weapon, you don’t need plasma to take out armoured foes. Besides, with the likely increase in decent cover saves, single-shot low AP weapons aren't worth much.
The same goes for meltaguns, but obviously if you’re equipping with them it’s to go tank hunting right? There are better-suited units to this role - however if you want anti vehicle a single chainfist in the unit makes more sense.
The humble flamer is a very attractive choice and its single use doesn’t seem like such a downside given how situational a weapon it is. Obviously with the new cover rules multiple flamers makes sense, and against hoard armies, deep striking and dropping four or more templates is hilarious
Let’s not forget that by ‘upgrading’ to a combi weapon you lose the valuable twin-linked quality of the humble combi-bolter. When it comes to small units maximizing their output is essential. Re-rolling to hit with rapid firing bolters is not to be underestimated!
In short I’d recommend not upgrading the combi-weapons, but if you do go with lots of flamers (at least 3) for flushing out cover hugging units.
Now the close combat weapons. We all love power fists, perhaps just a little too much. We’ve already got save ignoring close combat attacks, so do we need double strength (at I 1)? How often do you face opponents with T5 or more? How often do you face up against something that has multiple wounds that you can ‘instant death’?
Not so often I’ll bet, still it’s nice to have the option to squeeze something’s head off without really trying. Rather than buying a power fist for the unit get a chainfist. The added penetration against vehicles (and buildings) makes it far more valuable and useful. Also consider the chainfist vs. combi-melta: three single melta shots and reduced overall firepower (no twin-linked bolters
) or a ‘powerfist’ that can be used every turn, is as effective as a melta vs. suitable targets and doesn’t downgrade your firepower in anyway. Chainfist FTW!
Does anyone use single lightning claws? I used to as I thought the re-roll to wound was worth the cost, until I realised I should be taking four terminators rather than three with claws. Twin lightning claws are too cool for school - if you want to go that way equip the whole unit as such (with as many ‘champion’ upgrades as you can afford). Mix’n’match units don’t work in the long run. Simplicity and efficiency are important.
What about heavy weapons? Reaper autocannons are a bit odd. In fact I always found the autocannon (regardless of who/what is armed with it) to be at odds with the chaos space marine armoury. Decent range, high strength, AP 4? The problem is, as it is with any unit that contains a single heavy weapon, that you’ll fire at a unit that your bolters are ineffective against, or where your reaper is wasted overkill. You could perhaps go with a combi-plasma unit with reaper, but isn’t that just a retarded havoc or obliterator unit? The reaper is a nice looking weapon unique to our terminators; it’s no where near as badass as an assault cannon, and what’s more it’s not cheap.
A heavy flamer is cheap however, and will be effective alongside combi-bolters, it somewhat negates the need for combi-flamers unless you need the multiple template drop.
Oh, regarding the champion upgrade, comeback to it if you have the points left over when writing an army list. Remember you’re not gaining access to cool wargear by having a ‘champion’, and that generally more troops are better than few troops with an extra attack.
In summary: Terminators are already equipped the best way possible, if you fancy them a chainfist and a heavy flamer will give you some added situational flexibility. The only other unit builds worth considering are the 'BBQ' (multiple flamers & a heavy flamer), and the 'Plagueclaw' (all twin Lightning claws with as many champions as pos).
Chosen:Chosen are one of those units that GW come up with every now and supposedly to allow modellers to field their slightly oddball, heavily converted units, much like Flash Gitz of old and IG Veteran squads.
Regardless of the various options, these guys come with infiltrate and that should, to a certain extent, dictate their loud out and battlefield role. Thankfully infiltrate is always ‘on’ allowing you to get closer to the enemy, or to outflank them.
The first question you should ask yourself is
“why would I take a unit of Chosen in my Deathguard/Nurgle army?”Well with all non-Plaguemarine infantry units the answer is
“to do what my plague marines can’t”. This generally boils down to dedicated assault, tank/character hunting and extreme fire support. Chosen can be outfitted to cover any and indeed all of these roles; the problem is that many other units can do these jobs just as well, if not better than Chosen.
Competing with Chosen for an Elite slot are the mighty Terminators. With their power weapons and other close combat options they’re every bit as fearsome as Chosen if not more so given a Terminator’s higher base number of attacks. What’s more, with the various combi weapons fire support and ant-tank are something Terminators do very well, and they deep strike so are just as (if not more) mobile than Chosen.
Raptors and Bike units cover the hunter (and to a lesser extent assault) role very well, especially given their greater mobility on the battlefield. Then, of course, are the Havocs who have more choice of heavy weapons.
It may seem like Chosen are not an optimum choice as far as our army is concerned, I’d be inclined to agree. However, consider this – Terminators, Raptors and Bikes are all units that cost a chunk of points for few models and a chunk of cash for few models, Chosen are basically Chaos Marines with cool weapons, something we can do cheap and easy. You might also considering shunning the use of fast attack choices in favour of the traditional footslogging Deathguard army, this is when Chosen be come your best choice.
Let’s look at the options; first is the Champion upgrade (basically an extra attack), usually it is the champion alone who gets access to the various weapon upgrades on offer, this is not the case with Chosen. You can max out on the wargear (4 of your choice + 1 special/heavy) and then take a vanilla champion on top of that, or you could count him amongst those with weapon upgrades. The vanilla Chosen champion is the cheapest option for a daemonhost in the chaos army, coming in at 2 points cheaper than a regular Aspiring Champion!
The meat of the Chosen unit is the availability of all sorts of weapons for four lucky warriors.
The plasma pistol now will rarely see the light of day (eventually I’m going to have to replace them all, my Black and White Tarts had lots) because it uses up your ‘weapon slot’. Gone are the days of having plasma pistol alongside your power weapon/fist. It’s still a good weapon, but it’s costly and there are better options.
The rest of the weapons are either ‘shooty’ or ‘assaulty’ and mixing them is a bad idea. Whilst ‘covering all bases’ and ‘being jack of all trades’ are sound philosophies, on the table top efficiency counts; aim to do one thing really well and you will succeed in that task, attempt do a number things half-heartedly and you will fail every time.
Assault units are probably your best choice in a Deathguard/Nurgle army given that you should already have firepower aplenty.
You essentially have three choices – power weapon, power fist or a pair of lightning claws. A single claw is just stupid; it costs more than a pair and gains no bonus attack.
You probably all know my stand on powerfists – they’re damn good, very expensive, and more often than not, overkill. One is enough, in a large unit (10 men) two will do nicely, more than that and you’re seriously wasting points (3 powerfists = 1 Obliterator).
Regarding power weapons vs. (twin) lightning claws, the trade off is re-rolls to wound but lose your bolter (& pistol) for a few more points. It’s personal preference in my opinion, and most likely to be influenced by your models and conversions. Both work fine, and work just as well mixed.
Something else to consider with Chosen assault units is having a guy or two with meltabombs, assuming you don’t have a dedicated anti-tank unit elsewhere.
Once you’ve tooled up your four assault hombres you’re left with the option to have a further Chosen equipped with a special or heavy weapon. I don’t need to tell you not to put heavy or rapid-fire weapons in an assault squad, do I? Good. So it’s melta or flamer. The latter is the optimum choice, a single flamer always kicks butt, and a single melta often doesn’t.
Given the new wound/save allocation rules it’s hard to say what the best unit size is, my gut reaction is that more is better; a unit of between eight and ten Chosen including the Icon of Nurgle, one power fist, three power weapons/pairs of claws and a flamer will set you back between 269 and 320 points. That’s a big cost for a single unit, but it can cause some serious pain! Bear in mind that with Kill points effectively replacing Victory points you can get away with a seemingly over priced unit from time to time.
Chosen (ranged):The other build for a chosen unit is to go with a high proportion of special weapons.
A maximum of five flamers, meltaguns and plasmaguns are available, you also have options for combi-weapons, twin-linked bolters, and a single heavy weapon.
I can see very few reasons to take a heavy weapon; as I’ve said before mixing weapons rarely benefits you and having a static weapon in what is most often a mobile unit is just pointless.
The infiltrating unit of multiple special weapons will be an old favourite for players of the previous codex; well here it is again, this time in the Elites section. You can of course build more-or-less the same unit out of some Havocs. The traditional havoc squad won’t be able to infiltrate, has one less (only 4!) special weapon slot, but will work out a tad cheaper, plus it’s not eating a valuable Elite slot.
Lets have a look at the various Ranged Chosen builds:
All plasmaguns – you know you want to, a possible 10 AP2 hits. Mmm. If you follow my ranting you’ll be loading up on plasmaguns anyway, and as anyone will tell you concentrating fire form two units to destroy one is a good idea. So why take the super plasma squad of death? Clearly they are the bane of any heavy infantry unit and will happily munch through all but the toughest of units with ease. But isn’t your block of Plaguemarines doing that anyway? The all plasma unit is the sadist’s choice; it works, it’s scary, but it’s quite possibly overkill.
All meltaguns – the tank hunters are here and they mean business. 4 or 5 meltaguns should eat one tank per turn, and if there aren’t any tanks in range the monstrous creatures, heavy infantry and characters will feel the pain instead. You need to keep these guys mobile which means either Rhino or clever use of infiltration/outflanking and running. The problem with this unit is that it can often find itself without a target within range or worthy of its firepower.
All flamers (BBQ) – flamers are king in 5th. Cover? What cover? No more partial hits either, and with four or five templates you’ll be getting a lot of automatic hits. Even Meq and Teq should beware he BBQ unit. Like the melta unit positioning the BBQ Chosen is of paramount importance, in fact you may even find it pretty hard to make the most of all of your flamer templates at once.
Flamer/Melta – the short range of both weapons makes them obvious partners. In a Plaguemarine squad I advise against the flamer/melta comb because to guarantee the melta hits home, you really want two of them. With the multiple weapon slots available to the Chosen this isn’t an issue. Two meltaguns and three flamers gives the best of both worlds; anti-infantry and anti tank, and with sufficient numbers of each weapon to make them work as intended. Again, transport is almost mandatory. Of all the main builds this my favourite.
There are other unusual builds and combinations thereof: combi weapons can add a ‘quick fix’ to certain units, a combi-flamer with four melta guns (and vice versa) for example. Loading up on twin-linked bolters is something that appeals to me, probably in a 3:2 ratio with plasmaguns, creating an alternative commando Plaguemarine unit.
You don’t always need to go with five of a given weapon, often you’ll find weapons have an optimum number in which they are effective more than three flamers for example can be difficult to make the most of in one round of shooting. Then again, if you know three flamers is what works best for you, and you realise that you inevitably will take some casualties, a fourth flamer makes sense. The same reasoning applies to the other weapon builds. Don’t forget the option to have a special close combat weapon (on a champion or not) should you feel insecure without one. :shifty:
As I said before it’s difficult to say what size unit you should go for, but bear in mind that the pricey icon of Nurgle essentially gets cheaper with larger units and you’ll probably want some ablative wounds anyway. The min-max 5 man all plasma chosen with an Icon of Nurgle cost a whopping 200 points whereas 5 Terminators without any upgrades and the Icon of Nurgle cost 190!
I know which I’d choose
Possessed:+ Modelling potential
- Random ability
Chaos Space Marines:+ Cheap daemonhost alternative?
+ Heavy weapon
- Not Plaguemarines!
Raptors:Raptors?
In a Deathguard army? Heresy! Well, perhaps, if you are a staunch follower of the school of thought that the Deathguard are a footslogging army to the exclusion of everything else. I am not; I prefer to keep my gaming, modeling and fluff options open.
The first thing you need to realise about Raptors, in a Deathguard army at least, is that they are not a dedicated assault unit. Why? Well let me explain what I consider to be a dedicated assault unit; basically there are three categories – elitists, swarms and monster.
Elitists (not to be confused with Elite units as per force organisation) contain a high proportion of enhanced attacks such as power weapons, rending attacks, poison, high strength, furious charge and the like. Units such as Smelldar harlequins, Genestealers, Howling Banshees, Death Company etc fall under my ‘elitist’ label.
The swarm is pretty obvious, large numbers of attacks due to high model count or significant number of attacks per model (4+). Think Hormagaunts, large Ork mobs, and even large units of Angry Red Git Berzerkers.
Monsters are somewhere between the two having a significant amount of enhanced attacks. Think Monstrous creatures, most special characters and dreadnoughts etc.
Ok, back to Raptors. True you can equip a champion with a cool weapon, and the unit has close combat related wargear, but given the cost of the unit with the Icon of Nurgle you won’t be fielding nearly enough attacks to compete with an equal cost unit of Banshees or ‘gaunts.
So what are Raptors good for? Hunting. Thanks to the option for two special weapons and their speed Raptors make fantastic tank/character hunters. Meltaguns are the option of choice. Meltabombs as well, just in case. If you can spare the points a Power weapon could be a good investment, but it's certainly not mandatory.
Essentially your melta-raptors become a rapid response unit pouncing on suitable targets and leaving your Plaguemarine gunline to do its business unmolested. In the endgame they can support assaults led by your characters/terminators/daemons/baby owl.
Although not the only anti-tank option, Raptors do have some advantages in this task; first and foremost they’re not a big scary target like a Predator, Daemon Prince or Lord might be, the mobility granted by the jump packs and the fact that they can deepstrike gives them a significant edge.
A quick word on other Raptor builds – don’t give them plasma, leave that to the Plaguemarines. As for flamers, you should only equip them in high numbers, in which case sod the Raptors and go with 'BBQ' Terminators or Chosen. Vanilla Raptors could be useful as a ‘bodyguard’ for a winged/jump pack character; I’ll get to ‘bodyguard’ units when I go over the HQ choices.
In short, the best use for Raptors, in a Deathguard army, is as dedicated (tank) hunters. Whilst many people may not like the idea of one-trick units it is important to recognize that the majority of your army (Plaguemarines) cover a lot of bases already and that the melta-raptors are there to fill an obvious gap quickly and efficiently.
Chaos Space Marine Bikers:+ Fast delivery of meltas/champion/daemons via icon
+ T 6!
+Modelling potential
- Cost
- Not a hardcore dedicated assault unit
Havocs:+ Multiple Heavy weapons
